What color should the snow be in this chlorine world?












2












$begingroup$


This question is in the same context (the same world) proposed by Steven L. Gillett in his book: "World-building".
And actually there have been some other questions about this same chlorined world. For example this:



Are plastic plants plausible?



Long history short: The world is Earth-like (same biochemistry, carbon based also and oxygen breathers) but the atmosphere contains 1% chlorine.



Steven L. Gillett explains about the atmosphere:




"Chlorine is colored; as all the chemistry texts say, it’s a “greenish
yellow” gas. It absorbs blue light (and shorter wavelengths)
strongly."




and explains about the water:




"the acidity of surface water will be about like that of undiluted
vinegar."




I am trying to draw such a planet as accurate as possible, but I have a problem with the color of the polar ice caps and the snow. Although the planet has oceans and rivers of water, there will be a small amount of (an equivalent of) acid and bleach solution in the water. So, my question is: What color will the snow be in that planet?






science-based planets







share|improve this question









$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Are you aware of how incredibly toxic chlorine is ?
    $endgroup$
    – StephenG
    56 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StephenG, are you aware of how incredibly toxic oxygen is? If the atmosphere is 1% chlorine, then anything evolved there will be able to handle it.
    $endgroup$
    – Mark
    29 mins ago
















2












$begingroup$


This question is in the same context (the same world) proposed by Steven L. Gillett in his book: "World-building".
And actually there have been some other questions about this same chlorined world. For example this:



Are plastic plants plausible?



Long history short: The world is Earth-like (same biochemistry, carbon based also and oxygen breathers) but the atmosphere contains 1% chlorine.



Steven L. Gillett explains about the atmosphere:




"Chlorine is colored; as all the chemistry texts say, it’s a “greenish
yellow” gas. It absorbs blue light (and shorter wavelengths)
strongly."




and explains about the water:




"the acidity of surface water will be about like that of undiluted
vinegar."




I am trying to draw such a planet as accurate as possible, but I have a problem with the color of the polar ice caps and the snow. Although the planet has oceans and rivers of water, there will be a small amount of (an equivalent of) acid and bleach solution in the water. So, my question is: What color will the snow be in that planet?






science-based planets







share|improve this question









$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Are you aware of how incredibly toxic chlorine is ?
    $endgroup$
    – StephenG
    56 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StephenG, are you aware of how incredibly toxic oxygen is? If the atmosphere is 1% chlorine, then anything evolved there will be able to handle it.
    $endgroup$
    – Mark
    29 mins ago














2












2








2





$begingroup$


This question is in the same context (the same world) proposed by Steven L. Gillett in his book: "World-building".
And actually there have been some other questions about this same chlorined world. For example this:



Are plastic plants plausible?



Long history short: The world is Earth-like (same biochemistry, carbon based also and oxygen breathers) but the atmosphere contains 1% chlorine.



Steven L. Gillett explains about the atmosphere:




"Chlorine is colored; as all the chemistry texts say, it’s a “greenish
yellow” gas. It absorbs blue light (and shorter wavelengths)
strongly."




and explains about the water:




"the acidity of surface water will be about like that of undiluted
vinegar."




I am trying to draw such a planet as accurate as possible, but I have a problem with the color of the polar ice caps and the snow. Although the planet has oceans and rivers of water, there will be a small amount of (an equivalent of) acid and bleach solution in the water. So, my question is: What color will the snow be in that planet?






science-based planets







share|improve this question









$endgroup$




This question is in the same context (the same world) proposed by Steven L. Gillett in his book: "World-building".
And actually there have been some other questions about this same chlorined world. For example this:



Are plastic plants plausible?



Long history short: The world is Earth-like (same biochemistry, carbon based also and oxygen breathers) but the atmosphere contains 1% chlorine.



Steven L. Gillett explains about the atmosphere:




"Chlorine is colored; as all the chemistry texts say, it’s a “greenish
yellow” gas. It absorbs blue light (and shorter wavelengths)
strongly."




and explains about the water:




"the acidity of surface water will be about like that of undiluted
vinegar."




I am trying to draw such a planet as accurate as possible, but I have a problem with the color of the polar ice caps and the snow. Although the planet has oceans and rivers of water, there will be a small amount of (an equivalent of) acid and bleach solution in the water. So, my question is: What color will the snow be in that planet?






science-based planets




science-based planets






share|improve this question













share|improve this question











share|improve this question




share|improve this question










asked 3 hours ago









Carlos ZamoraCarlos Zamora

2,490423




2,490423








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Are you aware of how incredibly toxic chlorine is ?
    $endgroup$
    – StephenG
    56 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StephenG, are you aware of how incredibly toxic oxygen is? If the atmosphere is 1% chlorine, then anything evolved there will be able to handle it.
    $endgroup$
    – Mark
    29 mins ago














  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Are you aware of how incredibly toxic chlorine is ?
    $endgroup$
    – StephenG
    56 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    @StephenG, are you aware of how incredibly toxic oxygen is? If the atmosphere is 1% chlorine, then anything evolved there will be able to handle it.
    $endgroup$
    – Mark
    29 mins ago








1




1




$begingroup$
Are you aware of how incredibly toxic chlorine is ?
$endgroup$
– StephenG
56 mins ago




$begingroup$
Are you aware of how incredibly toxic chlorine is ?
$endgroup$
– StephenG
56 mins ago












$begingroup$
@StephenG, are you aware of how incredibly toxic oxygen is? If the atmosphere is 1% chlorine, then anything evolved there will be able to handle it.
$endgroup$
– Mark
29 mins ago




$begingroup$
@StephenG, are you aware of how incredibly toxic oxygen is? If the atmosphere is 1% chlorine, then anything evolved there will be able to handle it.
$endgroup$
– Mark
29 mins ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















3












$begingroup$

Since Chlorine doesn't become a liquid until roughly -34 C (-29 F) your snow will be mostly white. As a liquid it is amber in color and this will give your snow a slight yellow discoloration.



However, it will likely react with the water and create a weak acid (HCI or HOCI). Its usually clear, but can have a yellow discoloration.



If anything, your premise appears to be a little incorrect here. Chlorine is highly reactive so if you had 1% it would quickly react with other elements and disappear from its pure form. Water in the form of moisture, snow, rain would quickly remove all the chlorine in your atmosphere.






share|improve this answer









$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    "your snow will be mostly white" : Sorry, but I gotta ask, are you sure?
    $endgroup$
    – Pelinore
    2 hours ago












  • $begingroup$
    @Pelinore Yes... 1% chlorine in the atmosphere is different from solid chlorine
    $endgroup$
    – Shadowzee
    2 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    Ah yes, barely enough to even tint the result really [+]
    $endgroup$
    – Pelinore
    2 hours ago



















2












$begingroup$

Chlorine reacts with water in an equilibrium: Cl2 + H2O <-> HClO + HCl



As long as the pH doesn't rise this means there will always be some elemental Chlorine left. So water alone isn't a problem for your chlorinated atmosphere. The problem is, that any reducing agent on the ground will over time react with the atmosphere. Wood for example or any metals. Oxygen only does that with enough starting energy or over long periods, chlorine will happily react at room temperature with any biomass. You can see that this happened on our earth in the past, which is why the oceans are full of NaCl. So you might be able to sustain such an atmosphere if the surface is inert to the reaction with Chlorine.



As to the color of snow: Chlorine won't be trapped or solved in the ice just as CO2 isn't. The crystalization purifies the water and only traces of Cl2 should be found in it. So your snow should be white.






share|improve this answer









$endgroup$













    Your Answer





    StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
    return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
    StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
    StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
    });
    });
    }, "mathjax-editing");

    StackExchange.ready(function() {
    var channelOptions = {
    tags: "".split(" "),
    id: "579"
    };
    initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

    StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
    // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
    if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
    StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
    createEditor();
    });
    }
    else {
    createEditor();
    }
    });

    function createEditor() {
    StackExchange.prepareEditor({
    heartbeatType: 'answer',
    autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
    convertImagesToLinks: false,
    noModals: true,
    showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
    reputationToPostImages: null,
    bindNavPrevention: true,
    postfix: "",
    imageUploader: {
    brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
    contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
    allowUrls: true
    },
    noCode: true, onDemand: true,
    discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
    ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
    });


    }
    });














    draft saved

    draft discarded


















    StackExchange.ready(
    function () {
    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fworldbuilding.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f139147%2fwhat-color-should-the-snow-be-in-this-chlorine-world%23new-answer', 'question_page');
    }
    );

    Post as a guest















    Required, but never shown

























    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes








    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    3












    $begingroup$

    Since Chlorine doesn't become a liquid until roughly -34 C (-29 F) your snow will be mostly white. As a liquid it is amber in color and this will give your snow a slight yellow discoloration.



    However, it will likely react with the water and create a weak acid (HCI or HOCI). Its usually clear, but can have a yellow discoloration.



    If anything, your premise appears to be a little incorrect here. Chlorine is highly reactive so if you had 1% it would quickly react with other elements and disappear from its pure form. Water in the form of moisture, snow, rain would quickly remove all the chlorine in your atmosphere.






    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$













    • $begingroup$
      "your snow will be mostly white" : Sorry, but I gotta ask, are you sure?
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago












    • $begingroup$
      @Pelinore Yes... 1% chlorine in the atmosphere is different from solid chlorine
      $endgroup$
      – Shadowzee
      2 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      Ah yes, barely enough to even tint the result really [+]
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago
















    3












    $begingroup$

    Since Chlorine doesn't become a liquid until roughly -34 C (-29 F) your snow will be mostly white. As a liquid it is amber in color and this will give your snow a slight yellow discoloration.



    However, it will likely react with the water and create a weak acid (HCI or HOCI). Its usually clear, but can have a yellow discoloration.



    If anything, your premise appears to be a little incorrect here. Chlorine is highly reactive so if you had 1% it would quickly react with other elements and disappear from its pure form. Water in the form of moisture, snow, rain would quickly remove all the chlorine in your atmosphere.






    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$













    • $begingroup$
      "your snow will be mostly white" : Sorry, but I gotta ask, are you sure?
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago












    • $begingroup$
      @Pelinore Yes... 1% chlorine in the atmosphere is different from solid chlorine
      $endgroup$
      – Shadowzee
      2 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      Ah yes, barely enough to even tint the result really [+]
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago














    3












    3








    3





    $begingroup$

    Since Chlorine doesn't become a liquid until roughly -34 C (-29 F) your snow will be mostly white. As a liquid it is amber in color and this will give your snow a slight yellow discoloration.



    However, it will likely react with the water and create a weak acid (HCI or HOCI). Its usually clear, but can have a yellow discoloration.



    If anything, your premise appears to be a little incorrect here. Chlorine is highly reactive so if you had 1% it would quickly react with other elements and disappear from its pure form. Water in the form of moisture, snow, rain would quickly remove all the chlorine in your atmosphere.






    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$



    Since Chlorine doesn't become a liquid until roughly -34 C (-29 F) your snow will be mostly white. As a liquid it is amber in color and this will give your snow a slight yellow discoloration.



    However, it will likely react with the water and create a weak acid (HCI or HOCI). Its usually clear, but can have a yellow discoloration.



    If anything, your premise appears to be a little incorrect here. Chlorine is highly reactive so if you had 1% it would quickly react with other elements and disappear from its pure form. Water in the form of moisture, snow, rain would quickly remove all the chlorine in your atmosphere.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered 2 hours ago









    ShadowzeeShadowzee

    8,8861642




    8,8861642












    • $begingroup$
      "your snow will be mostly white" : Sorry, but I gotta ask, are you sure?
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago












    • $begingroup$
      @Pelinore Yes... 1% chlorine in the atmosphere is different from solid chlorine
      $endgroup$
      – Shadowzee
      2 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      Ah yes, barely enough to even tint the result really [+]
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago


















    • $begingroup$
      "your snow will be mostly white" : Sorry, but I gotta ask, are you sure?
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago












    • $begingroup$
      @Pelinore Yes... 1% chlorine in the atmosphere is different from solid chlorine
      $endgroup$
      – Shadowzee
      2 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      Ah yes, barely enough to even tint the result really [+]
      $endgroup$
      – Pelinore
      2 hours ago
















    $begingroup$
    "your snow will be mostly white" : Sorry, but I gotta ask, are you sure?
    $endgroup$
    – Pelinore
    2 hours ago






    $begingroup$
    "your snow will be mostly white" : Sorry, but I gotta ask, are you sure?
    $endgroup$
    – Pelinore
    2 hours ago














    $begingroup$
    @Pelinore Yes... 1% chlorine in the atmosphere is different from solid chlorine
    $endgroup$
    – Shadowzee
    2 hours ago




    $begingroup$
    @Pelinore Yes... 1% chlorine in the atmosphere is different from solid chlorine
    $endgroup$
    – Shadowzee
    2 hours ago












    $begingroup$
    Ah yes, barely enough to even tint the result really [+]
    $endgroup$
    – Pelinore
    2 hours ago




    $begingroup$
    Ah yes, barely enough to even tint the result really [+]
    $endgroup$
    – Pelinore
    2 hours ago











    2












    $begingroup$

    Chlorine reacts with water in an equilibrium: Cl2 + H2O <-> HClO + HCl



    As long as the pH doesn't rise this means there will always be some elemental Chlorine left. So water alone isn't a problem for your chlorinated atmosphere. The problem is, that any reducing agent on the ground will over time react with the atmosphere. Wood for example or any metals. Oxygen only does that with enough starting energy or over long periods, chlorine will happily react at room temperature with any biomass. You can see that this happened on our earth in the past, which is why the oceans are full of NaCl. So you might be able to sustain such an atmosphere if the surface is inert to the reaction with Chlorine.



    As to the color of snow: Chlorine won't be trapped or solved in the ice just as CO2 isn't. The crystalization purifies the water and only traces of Cl2 should be found in it. So your snow should be white.






    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$


















      2












      $begingroup$

      Chlorine reacts with water in an equilibrium: Cl2 + H2O <-> HClO + HCl



      As long as the pH doesn't rise this means there will always be some elemental Chlorine left. So water alone isn't a problem for your chlorinated atmosphere. The problem is, that any reducing agent on the ground will over time react with the atmosphere. Wood for example or any metals. Oxygen only does that with enough starting energy or over long periods, chlorine will happily react at room temperature with any biomass. You can see that this happened on our earth in the past, which is why the oceans are full of NaCl. So you might be able to sustain such an atmosphere if the surface is inert to the reaction with Chlorine.



      As to the color of snow: Chlorine won't be trapped or solved in the ice just as CO2 isn't. The crystalization purifies the water and only traces of Cl2 should be found in it. So your snow should be white.






      share|improve this answer









      $endgroup$
















        2












        2








        2





        $begingroup$

        Chlorine reacts with water in an equilibrium: Cl2 + H2O <-> HClO + HCl



        As long as the pH doesn't rise this means there will always be some elemental Chlorine left. So water alone isn't a problem for your chlorinated atmosphere. The problem is, that any reducing agent on the ground will over time react with the atmosphere. Wood for example or any metals. Oxygen only does that with enough starting energy or over long periods, chlorine will happily react at room temperature with any biomass. You can see that this happened on our earth in the past, which is why the oceans are full of NaCl. So you might be able to sustain such an atmosphere if the surface is inert to the reaction with Chlorine.



        As to the color of snow: Chlorine won't be trapped or solved in the ice just as CO2 isn't. The crystalization purifies the water and only traces of Cl2 should be found in it. So your snow should be white.






        share|improve this answer









        $endgroup$



        Chlorine reacts with water in an equilibrium: Cl2 + H2O <-> HClO + HCl



        As long as the pH doesn't rise this means there will always be some elemental Chlorine left. So water alone isn't a problem for your chlorinated atmosphere. The problem is, that any reducing agent on the ground will over time react with the atmosphere. Wood for example or any metals. Oxygen only does that with enough starting energy or over long periods, chlorine will happily react at room temperature with any biomass. You can see that this happened on our earth in the past, which is why the oceans are full of NaCl. So you might be able to sustain such an atmosphere if the surface is inert to the reaction with Chlorine.



        As to the color of snow: Chlorine won't be trapped or solved in the ice just as CO2 isn't. The crystalization purifies the water and only traces of Cl2 should be found in it. So your snow should be white.







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered 2 hours ago









        ZeodynZeodyn

        313




        313






























            draft saved

            draft discarded




















































            Thanks for contributing an answer to Worldbuilding Stack Exchange!


            • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

            But avoid …



            • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

            • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


            Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


            To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




            draft saved


            draft discarded














            StackExchange.ready(
            function () {
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fworldbuilding.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f139147%2fwhat-color-should-the-snow-be-in-this-chlorine-world%23new-answer', 'question_page');
            }
            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown





















































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown

































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown







            -

            Popular posts from this blog

            Ponta tanko

            Image
            Usona ponta tanko M60A1 Ponta tanko estas, simile kiel kirasita savveturilo, inter specialaj kirasitaj transportiloj. Kiel pontaj tankoj eblas konsideri ĉiujn memmovigaj rimedoj ebligantaj superi obstaklojn ĝis larĝeco 24 metroj rekte en spaco de bataloperacoj. Ties ĉefa tasko estas ebligi al la propraj taĉmentoj daŭrigi en rapida antaŭenirado sen senbezona reteniĝo. El tio pli-malpli rezultas taktikaj-teknikaj postuloj, kiujn ili devas plenumi. Precipe temas pri kapablo operacii komune kun unue-sinsekvaj taĉmentoj kaj transpontigi obstaklojn dum kelke da minutoj. This page is only for reference, If you need detailed information, please check here
            Read more

            Tantalo (mitologio)

            Image
            Ĉi tiu artikolo temas pri mitologio. Por aliaj signifoj vidu la paĝon Tantalo (apartigilo) . Tantalo , laŭ Gioacchino Assereto. Laŭ la helena mitologio, Tantalo (el la greka Τάνταλος , ŝancelanta aŭ tre malfeliĉa ) estis filo de Zeŭso kaj la oceanidino Pluto, laŭ la plej divastigata versio. Li estis reĝo de Frigio [1] aŭ de la monto Sipilo, en Lidio (Malgrandazio) [2] kaj post sia morto li suferis eternan torturadon ĉe la Tartaro, la plej profunda parto de Hadeso, rezervita por la plej perversaj homoj. Tamen, kelkaj rakontoj asertas ke li estis reĝo de Argo aŭ de Korinto [3] , aŭ ke li migris norden el la monto Sipilo por akiri la tronon de Paflagonio, el kie Ilo forpelis lin pro tio, ke Tantalo forkaptis kaj seksperfortis lian fraton Ganimedon [4] , kaj tiel ofendis la diojn. Verŝajne li ankaŭ regis urbon en okcidenta Anatolio, kiun oni nomis Tantalis [5] pro li, aŭ Sipilo , pro la monto sur kies flanko ankoraŭ staras ĝiaj ruinaĵoj [6] . Laŭ la geografiisto Strabo,...
            Read more

            Erzsébet Schaár

            Image
            Erzsébet Schaár Memportreto de Erzsébet Schaár en Pécs Personaj informoj Naskiĝo 27-an de julio 1908 ( 1908-07-27 ) en Budafok Morto 29-an de aŭgusto 1975 ( 1975-08-29 ) (67-jara) en Budapeŝto Ŝtataneco Hungario Profesio skulptisto Familianoj Edz(in)o Tibor Vilt v   •   d   •   r Erzsébet Schaár [erĵEbet ŝAr], laŭ hungarlingve kutima sinsekvo Schaár Erzsébet estis hungara skulptisto. Ŝia edzo estis Tibor Vilt. Déryné Széppataki Róza en Miskolc fare de Erzsébet Schaár Erzsébet Schaár [1] naskiĝis la 27-an de julio 1908 en Budafok, ŝi mortis la 29-an de aŭgusto 1975 en Budapeŝto. Enhavo 1 Biografio 2 Elektitaj solaj ekspozicioj 3 Elektitaj kolektivaj ekspozicioj 4 Elektitaj skulptaĵoj 5 Elektitaj disĉiploj 6 Fontoj 7 Referencoj Biografio | Erzsébet Schaár studis en Industriarta Lernejo, poste en Reĝa Belarta Altlernejo (1924-1926). Ŝia ĉefinstruisto estis Zsig...
            Read more